Ebay gold... - Guild Wars Forums

Daemon Dremora · Apr 26, 2006, 04:00 AM // 04:00

ok i tried to search about this but the search engine is down so.... i'm gonna make my own post. i was just wondering if there is anyone else out there who thinks that the ability to buy gw gold off of ebay is cheap. and possibly should be stopped. i mean back in the day if you seen someone with fow armor you were like "wow they have really worked hard for what they have" anymore it is like "wow they have fow armor they must buy gold off of ebay" i think it just totaly ruined some aspects of the game. i do understand that there are many mmo's out there where you can buy their currency off of ebay but i just drives me crazy. i was just wondering if anyone else out there felt the same way......and plz no flaming.

VIB · Apr 26, 2006, 04:27 AM // 04:27

It ruins every game, always will and the game companies will always try to minimize it the most. But unfortunally there is no easy way to track it down. I bet ANet does their best, but their best is almost nothing because it just too hard to handle this issue.

The only perfect solution would be designing a game from scratch with no trades at all, no way to give items or money for other players. But then again a tradeless RPG would lose a huge bunch of what players like on it. Would you rather play a game where you can buy/sell to/from other players or a game without e-bayers? Until someone makes a RPG with no trading at all, e-bayers and chinese farmers will be all around.

I personally think that a heavilly PvP focused game like GW could really be still an awesome game without trades, but I am sure 99% of the playerbase would disagree..

Daemon Dremora · Apr 26, 2006, 05:11 AM // 05:11

oh i completely agree with you. with out trade gw would lose alot of popularity. even though i did not say get rid of trading. i do understand that getting rid of trading would be the only viable way of getting rid of ebay gold. i just wish there was some way to get rid of the ability to buy it on ebay.

Chilly Ress · Apr 26, 2006, 03:41 PM // 15:41

I dont know if it ruins the game so much as the solo farming for hours upon end (thats a different story). It may hurt the game a little, but, go around LA d1, can you positively be sure who exactly has eBayed and who has just been good at trading or gotten lucky. And for those who do eBay, their money, their choice, although I strongly believe Anet should crack down on them.

charlotte liangrin · Apr 26, 2006, 03:52 PM // 15:52

On a game like guild wars, i havnt found any trouble at getting money. During my third day playing, i already had over 50 plat and a perfect green bow as well as a perfect gold bow. I tried to sell my bow to a level 20 (im lvl 12) and he couldnt afford it because he only had 2 plat. But on a game such as WoW, (my bro plays it, im not allowed) i can understand buying money because of the high difficulty of finding money....

EternalTempest · Apr 26, 2006, 03:59 PM // 15:59

It's also against the EULA (there is arugment about this if the EULA is really legal) but if they catch you, they will shut down there account.

VIB -> It's pvp and pve game aka in that 99%

As far as "damage" since FOW is just looks no stat and "perfect" and cheap "near-perfect" stat wise offers very little advantage I do agree that gold does not hurt the game as musch as other mmorph's but inflation caused by gold purchase's do hurt GW.

Thorinfire · Apr 26, 2006, 04:00 PM // 16:00

The only way you are going to stop Gold buying on ebay is to get the players to stop buying it.

Its supply and demand, if we stop buying it the farmers go out of business.

fiery · Apr 26, 2006, 04:18 PM // 16:18

Rawr rawr another rant about the illegal use of Ebay. We can't shut down all links, knock down bussinesses who corporate the use of Ebaying gold, we just can't. This is just how it's gunna be from now to than.

Is Ebaying gold hurting you? Is it affecting your drops, your income when farming, no it doesn't. There are countless threads on ebaying gold and we just don't need another one.

Batius · Apr 26, 2006, 04:21 PM // 16:21

It's hard for Anet to crack down on it because there is actually no crime being commited as far as I know.
E-bayers are very sly and clearly put in the auction that the buyer is paying ONLY for the time of the seller, and that the game items are always property of Anet etc. So there is nothing Anet can do, and as for checking everyones trade to try and spot E-bayers, well theres just too much and it can't be proven anyway.
I neither agree nor disagree with e-bay money. I disagree because the game has plenty money around for people to earn different ways, you just need a bit of elbow grease. There are many players, including myself, who spend hours farming to save up enough for something they need, and it hardly seems fair that someone else can aquire more cash in less time. However I don't have much of a problem with it, after all, you can do what you want with your cash, and just like buying extra slots for more characters, if you feel buying IG Cash will enhance your game play, go for it, but I myself feel like I've achieved something when I rake in cash from my own efforts.
This subject like many has no right and wrong, just different opinions

Rayinzar · Apr 26, 2006, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Well I'm personally of the opinion that there's nothing wrong with it at all. IF people don't have the time or will to play, there's no reason they shouldn't spend their money as they see fit. It's hardly unlike the real world in that regard. The right amount can always give you an edge.

It may (and most certainly not always) encourage a line of work in some areas that may be morally disagreeable, but that in no way negates either the time someone has put in to getting that gold, and would now like to be paid for. And really, it's not actually "sly". That is literally what it is. An exchange of time for money. Or luck if that's how you got it, but then there's always the lottery

=HT=Ingram · Apr 26, 2006, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiery

Rawr rawr another rant about the illegal use of Ebay. We can't shut down all links, knock down bussinesses who corporate the use of Ebaying gold, we just can't. This is just how it's gunna be from now to than.

Is Ebaying gold hurting you? Is it affecting your drops, your income when farming, no it doesn't. There are countless threads on ebaying gold and we just don't need another one.

I bring your attention to the EULA you just agreed to you fool!!!

Quote:

7. OFFICIAL SERVICE

Guild Wars is designed for official play only as offered through the Service by NC Interactive at the Web Site and not through any other means. You further agree not to access, create or provide any other means through which Guild Wars may be played by others, as through server emulators. You agree not to use any hardware or software, including but not limited to third party tools, or any other method of support which may in any way influence or advantage your use of the Service which is not authorized by NC Interactive, including but not limited to the use of ???bots??? and/or any other method by which the Service may be played automatically without human input. You acknowledge that you do not have the right to create, publish, distribute, create derivative works from or use any software programs, utilities, applications, emulators or tools derived from or created for Guild Wars, except that you may use the Software to the extent expressly permitted by this Agreement. You may not take any action which imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load on our infrastructure. You may not sell or auction any Guild Wars accounts, characters, items, coin or copyrighted material, nor may you assist others in doing so.

and

Quote:

Section 4.
(h) Former Members. Members whose Accounts have been terminated by NC Interactive may not access the Service in any manner or for any reason, including through any other Account, without the express written permission of NC Interactive. Accounts accessed by Former Members are subject to immediate termination. NC Interactive reserves the right to use any means necessary, included those in section 4(i) to identify and remove Former Members.

(i) Related Accounts. If NC Interactive terminates an Account, NC Interactive may terminate any other Accounts that share the same member name, phone number, email address, postal address, Internet Protocol address, or credit card number with the terminated Account.

and

Quote:

14. TERMINATION

(a) NC Interactive reserves the right to suspend or terminate this Agreement (including your Software license and your Account) immediately and without notice if you breach this Agreement or willfully infringe any third party intellectual property rights, or if we are unable to verify or authenticate any information you provide to us, or upon game play, chat or any player activity whatsoever which is, in our sole discretion, inappropriate and/or in violation of the spirit of Guild Wars as described in the Rules of Conduct.

Should NC Interactive decide to suspend or terminate this Agreement with a User under any circumstances, the User will lose access to your Account.

(b) You agree that if the Service or your Account is suspended, terminated or cancelled for any reason or length of time, you are not entitled to any reimbursement or refund of any fees or unused access time.

In other words STFU you gold buying A$$. your encouraging activity that will get you BANNED and rightfully so.

Batius · Apr 26, 2006, 08:07 PM // 20:07

The above quoting is true, yet it will not stop people from doing it.
After all, unless Anet have proof they will not close down an account, if they did, they would be liable to suing. As far as I know theres no way they could get proof, they do not have access to the details of the people who use Ebay, and if they banned any account that involved people giving money in the trade window then you would hit all kinds of problems. Say I had a friend who had just started the game and I wanted to help them by giving them 100k, if Anet turned around and banned me for that, I'd be pretty p*$$**. And yes, this can happen, because I actually do have a friend I know in person and do give gold to.
Ok sure, we all signed that agreement, but does anyone actually read all that crap? I'd be interested to see how many do.
Anyway this topic is like any other, you got two sides. Neither is right or wrong so theres no point arguing about it. And whether gold is bought or not really does not affect anybody in the slightest, we all still farm, get items, and sell them. Whether you sell them for gold aquired by clean methods or by ebay won't matter in the slightest to us, so who cares?
Let those who want to run the risk, run the risk and maybe if/when they get banned they'll think if they should of or not. Until then, let them be.

Haggard · Apr 26, 2006, 10:21 PM // 22:21

I don't think its strictly true that FoW armour is alays ebayed. The masisve farming surge of the last 2-3 months has gotten a lot of poeple very rich. And some people just have a great eye for investement, and make their money that way. A friend of mine played the markets on WoW, and under the GW/WoW exchange rates he made the equivalent of 700 million GW gold. In 6 months.

Kityn · Apr 26, 2006, 10:30 PM // 22:30

Just because some idiot spent their allowance/paycheck on a fantasy game item/gold doesnt mean they will ever be a good player. Quick and easy way doesn't equal skill.

Beat_Go_Stick · Apr 26, 2006, 10:31 PM // 22:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thorinfire

The only way you are going to stop Gold buying on ebay is to get the players to stop buying it.

Its supply and demand, if we stop buying it the farmers go out of business.

Actually (and I'm surprised they don't just do this) the best way to stop this and shut down the farms would be to allow the players to purchase gold from A.Net. It's pretty much been proven that a wealthy player would much rather spend $60 to be rich than spend 600+ hours farming so they can be rich...especially if they happen to make $60/hour from their business and would rather spend that time doing other things.

Now we have already established there is no need to be wealthy in Guild Wars but that doesn't stop anyone from wanting to be. So long as people want something, it creates a profitable business opportunity to provide what they want at a reasonable cost. If A.Net would accept the fact (and yes, I consider it a fact) that people will find a way to get what they want, then a solution could easily be reached.

A.Net could easily undercut the farmers. If A.net started selling gold for less than the farmers, not only would it create an extra source of income for the developers (let's face it, business is booming in the sweat shops of China), but it would also make selling gold on ebay much less profitable.

Think about it, if you could go on ebay, risk getting caught, getting banned, getting ripped off, etc. or you could go to guildwars.com and buy it legal and legit from the company that made the game, which would you choose?

I don't really understand why A.Net hasn't just tried diverting all this real $$$ from China to their own pockets. To not begin the game doing it is understandable. They wanted an economy, they wanted a system where everything in-game was earned. Well, time to realize that the economy is farmer driven and getting around the necessity to earn your rewards in-game are easy as easy can be to dance around.

Regardless, I doubt they will start selling their own gold and I'm sure the farmers will keep botting and farming, taking millions upon millions of dollars away from what could be A.Nets pocket. So be it

Mako · Apr 26, 2006, 10:31 PM // 22:31

If youre stupid enough to pump money into a game you already baught then do it. There is no monthly fee because gw isnt good enough, but the people who ebay gold are pumping money into it anyways. Sure they can buy all the fow and godly weps they want but did they earn them? No, in forming that people who ebay'd their fow armor will never be able to feel the sense of accomplishment that the people do who worked for it, this is something you CANNOT buy.

Dr Ripley · Apr 26, 2006, 10:47 PM // 22:47

"There is no monthly fee because GW isn't good enough"?? Please explain...

Dagoth Umbra · Apr 26, 2006, 11:01 PM // 23:01

The reason ebaying exists is because some people have lives and would prefer not to spend 1k hours just to get 1 suite of fow. Yes, they would probably be able to get a suite sooner, but it still is an insane amount of time to spend. I want to be able to have and show every single skin for all weapons, shield, focii, and armor, for all characters, thats what I want. If I later decided I wanted PERFECT stats on those skins, I could set about slaving away to get them, but that would be my choice. But I think this crap of making skins that are either extremely time consuming/difficult to get (FoW armor), skins that you cant get if you missed a certain day due to uncontrollable causes (pc crash), or even skins one cannot get AT ALL, such as pre-order items, is plain frickin BS. If someone wants to get the gold trim on their capes for being a tournament winner, or farm for 100s of hours to find a rare item or the money to get it, if they are that obsessive, then they must slave away, and the reward is well deserved and should be only theirs. But, for example, making weapon skins that Americans will never be able to get because they were designed for only korean pre-orders is downright ****ed up. This day of the tengu event is another ****ed up deal. I decided to order the pre-order from ebay wednesday morning, it might not make it in time, then I will have spent 22 bucks (7+15 express shipping) for nothing, a useless pre-order. Seriously, I might get so angry I might go to my school and kill people, and none of that "its just a game" bs, I have spent 100s of hours of my life on this game, am about to spend 100s more, yet I wont get to fully enjoy it, enjoy all of the beautiful skins. I think people should be able to either buy the special stuff, and get it easily, like if people buy the pre-order, they can get the masks easily, but if a person misses it because of events outside their control, they can still EARN it, even if by doing an insanely hard quest or a certain amount of pvp to get it. That means if anyone missed the pumpkin head, santa hat, horns of grenthy, tengu mask, or didnt buy a CE to get the divine aura, they can still get them, it will just cost them time and lots of hardcore playing. And, for naysayers, I bought the CE, and was at both Halloween and Wintersday, and I still dont mind if someone wants to earn what I payed for or spent a few hours to get.

fiery · Apr 26, 2006, 11:10 PM // 23:10

Quote:

Posted By: =HT=Ingram
In other words STFU you gold buying A$$. your encouraging activity that will get you BANNED and rightfully so.

I have never Ebayed one single gold or platinum from my account. I don't even have an credit card or Ebay account, I made my million the old fashion way with farming. You can shove rules down my throat and others but planly it's just another rant thread about ebay.

Beat_Go_Stick · Apr 27, 2006, 12:00 AM // 00:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mako

If youre stupid enough to pump money into a game you already baught then do it. There is no monthly fee because gw isnt good enough, but the people who ebay gold are pumping money into it anyways. Sure they can buy all the fow and godly weps they want but did they earn them? No, in forming that people who ebay'd their fow armor will never be able to feel the sense of accomplishment that the people do who worked for it, this is something you CANNOT buy.

Believe it or not, some people gain a sense of accomplishment from having a thing, not earning a thing. Me? I think have the fun is playing the game and finding the things I use. Many people do not share that sentiment.

Not to mention the time aspect of it. If you make $50/hour or more at work, spending $50 on enough gold to make farming irrelevant isn't such a crazy idea since farming is considered by many to be just another form of (yep, you guessed it) work.

Apr 26, 2006, 04:00 AM // 04:00	#1
Daemon Dremora Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Millington, TN Guild: Seele Erntemaschine {Nein}	Ebay gold... ok i tried to search about this but the search engine is down so.... i'm gonna make my own post. i was just wondering if there is anyone else out there who thinks that the ability to buy gw gold off of ebay is cheap. and possibly should be stopped. i mean back in the day if you seen someone with fow armor you were like "wow they have really worked hard for what they have" anymore it is like "wow they have fow armor they must buy gold off of ebay" i think it just totaly ruined some aspects of the game. i do understand that there are many mmo's out there where you can buy their currency off of ebay but i just drives me crazy. i was just wondering if anyone else out there felt the same way......and plz no flaming.

Apr 26, 2006, 04:27 AM // 04:27	#2
VIB Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Apr 2006	It ruins every game, always will and the game companies will always try to minimize it the most. But unfortunally there is no easy way to track it down. I bet ANet does their best, but their best is almost nothing because it just too hard to handle this issue. The only perfect solution would be designing a game from scratch with no trades at all, no way to give items or money for other players. But then again a tradeless RPG would lose a huge bunch of what players like on it. Would you rather play a game where you can buy/sell to/from other players or a game without e-bayers? Until someone makes a RPG with no trading at all, e-bayers and chinese farmers will be all around. I personally think that a heavilly PvP focused game like GW could really be still an awesome game without trades, but I am sure 99% of the playerbase would disagree..

Apr 26, 2006, 05:11 AM // 05:11	#3
Daemon Dremora Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Millington, TN Guild: Seele Erntemaschine {Nein}	oh i completely agree with you. with out trade gw would lose alot of popularity. even though i did not say get rid of trading. i do understand that getting rid of trading would be the only viable way of getting rid of ebay gold. i just wish there was some way to get rid of the ability to buy it on ebay.

Apr 26, 2006, 03:41 PM // 15:41	#4
Chilly Ress Jungle Guide Join Date: Oct 2005 Guild: Kinetic Fusion [kF] Profession: Me/	I dont know if it ruins the game so much as the solo farming for hours upon end (thats a different story). It may hurt the game a little, but, go around LA d1, can you positively be sure who exactly has eBayed and who has just been good at trading or gotten lucky. And for those who do eBay, their money, their choice, although I strongly believe Anet should crack down on them.

Apr 26, 2006, 03:52 PM // 15:52	#5
charlotte liangrin Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Apr 2006 Guild: Seven hexes Profession: R/Mo	On a game like guild wars, i havnt found any trouble at getting money. During my third day playing, i already had over 50 plat and a perfect green bow as well as a perfect gold bow. I tried to sell my bow to a level 20 (im lvl 12) and he couldnt afford it because he only had 2 plat. But on a game such as WoW, (my bro plays it, im not allowed) i can understand buying money because of the high difficulty of finding money....

Apr 26, 2006, 03:59 PM // 15:59	#6
EternalTempest Furnace Stoker Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: United States Guild: Dark Side Ofthe Moon [DSM] Profession: E/	It's also against the EULA (there is arugment about this if the EULA is really legal) but if they catch you, they will shut down there account. VIB -> It's pvp and pve game aka in that 99% As far as "damage" since FOW is just looks no stat and "perfect" and cheap "near-perfect" stat wise offers very little advantage I do agree that gold does not hurt the game as musch as other mmorph's but inflation caused by gold purchase's do hurt GW.

Apr 26, 2006, 04:00 PM // 16:00	#7
Thorinfire Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Shiverpeaks Guild: Ambassadors of Enlightenment [SAGE] Profession: R/	The only way you are going to stop Gold buying on ebay is to get the players to stop buying it. Its supply and demand, if we stop buying it the farmers go out of business.

Apr 26, 2006, 04:18 PM // 16:18	#8
fiery Banned Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: maryland Guild: InYurFace Gaming [IYF] Profession: R/	Rawr rawr another rant about the illegal use of Ebay. We can't shut down all links, knock down bussinesses who corporate the use of Ebaying gold, we just can't. This is just how it's gunna be from now to than. Is Ebaying gold hurting you? Is it affecting your drops, your income when farming, no it doesn't. There are countless threads on ebaying gold and we just don't need another one.

Apr 26, 2006, 04:21 PM // 16:21	#9
Batius Academy Page Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: England Guild: Sons of Evil Profession: W/Mo	It's hard for Anet to crack down on it because there is actually no crime being commited as far as I know. E-bayers are very sly and clearly put in the auction that the buyer is paying ONLY for the time of the seller, and that the game items are always property of Anet etc. So there is nothing Anet can do, and as for checking everyones trade to try and spot E-bayers, well theres just too much and it can't be proven anyway. I neither agree nor disagree with e-bay money. I disagree because the game has plenty money around for people to earn different ways, you just need a bit of elbow grease. There are many players, including myself, who spend hours farming to save up enough for something they need, and it hardly seems fair that someone else can aquire more cash in less time. However I don't have much of a problem with it, after all, you can do what you want with your cash, and just like buying extra slots for more characters, if you feel buying IG Cash will enhance your game play, go for it, but I myself feel like I've achieved something when I rake in cash from my own efforts. This subject like many has no right and wrong, just different opinions

Apr 26, 2006, 04:43 PM // 16:43	#10
Rayinzar Academy Page Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Europe Guild: Blue Moon Shadow {CAT} Profession: Me/R	Well I'm personally of the opinion that there's nothing wrong with it at all. IF people don't have the time or will to play, there's no reason they shouldn't spend their money as they see fit. It's hardly unlike the real world in that regard. The right amount can always give you an edge. It may (and most certainly not always) encourage a line of work in some areas that may be morally disagreeable, but that in no way negates either the time someone has put in to getting that gold, and would now like to be paid for. And really, it's not actually "sly". That is literally what it is. An exchange of time for money. Or luck if that's how you got it, but then there's always the lottery

Apr 26, 2006, 08:07 PM // 20:07	#12
Batius Academy Page Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: England Guild: Sons of Evil Profession: W/Mo	The above quoting is true, yet it will not stop people from doing it. After all, unless Anet have proof they will not close down an account, if they did, they would be liable to suing. As far as I know theres no way they could get proof, they do not have access to the details of the people who use Ebay, and if they banned any account that involved people giving money in the trade window then you would hit all kinds of problems. Say I had a friend who had just started the game and I wanted to help them by giving them 100k, if Anet turned around and banned me for that, I'd be pretty p$$*. And yes, this can happen, because I actually do have a friend I know in person and do give gold to. Ok sure, we all signed that agreement, but does anyone actually read all that crap? I'd be interested to see how many do. Anyway this topic is like any other, you got two sides. Neither is right or wrong so theres no point arguing about it. And whether gold is bought or not really does not affect anybody in the slightest, we all still farm, get items, and sell them. Whether you sell them for gold aquired by clean methods or by ebay won't matter in the slightest to us, so who cares? Let those who want to run the risk, run the risk and maybe if/when they get banned they'll think if they should of or not. Until then, let them be.

Apr 26, 2006, 10:21 PM // 22:21	#13
Haggard Desert Nomad Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Urmston, Manchester, UK Guild: Greener Pastures [DVDF] Profession: W/Rt	I don't think its strictly true that FoW armour is alays ebayed. The masisve farming surge of the last 2-3 months has gotten a lot of poeple very rich. And some people just have a great eye for investement, and make their money that way. A friend of mine played the markets on WoW, and under the GW/WoW exchange rates he made the equivalent of 700 million GW gold. In 6 months.

Apr 26, 2006, 10:30 PM // 22:30	#14
Kityn Krytan Explorer Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Michigan Guild: Heroes of the Horn [HoH] Profession: N/	Just because some idiot spent their allowance/paycheck on a fantasy game item/gold doesnt mean they will ever be a good player. Quick and easy way doesn't equal skill.

Apr 26, 2006, 10:31 PM // 22:31	#16
Mako Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Midgar - Sector 7 Guild: Star Scar Reunion [VII] Profession: N/Me	If youre stupid enough to pump money into a game you already baught then do it. There is no monthly fee because gw isnt good enough, but the people who ebay gold are pumping money into it anyways. Sure they can buy all the fow and godly weps they want but did they earn them? No, in forming that people who ebay'd their fow armor will never be able to feel the sense of accomplishment that the people do who worked for it, this is something you CANNOT buy.

Apr 26, 2006, 10:47 PM // 22:47	#17
Dr Ripley Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Seattle Guild: Force of Arms [FoA]	"There is no monthly fee because GW isn't good enough"?? Please explain...

Apr 26, 2006, 11:01 PM // 23:01	#18
Dagoth Umbra Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In Cartman's Brain, Directing. Guild: Lazy Dominus Legatus [LaZy] Profession: W/E	The reason ebaying exists is because some people have lives and would prefer not to spend 1k hours just to get 1 suite of fow. Yes, they would probably be able to get a suite sooner, but it still is an insane amount of time to spend. I want to be able to have and show every single skin for all weapons, shield, focii, and armor, for all characters, thats what I want. If I later decided I wanted PERFECT stats on those skins, I could set about slaving away to get them, but that would be my choice. But I think this crap of making skins that are either extremely time consuming/difficult to get (FoW armor), skins that you cant get if you missed a certain day due to uncontrollable causes (pc crash), or even skins one cannot get AT ALL, such as pre-order items, is plain frickin BS. If someone wants to get the gold trim on their capes for being a tournament winner, or farm for 100s of hours to find a rare item or the money to get it, if they are that obsessive, then they must slave away, and the reward is well deserved and should be only theirs. But, for example, making weapon skins that Americans will never be able to get because they were designed for only korean pre-orders is downright **ed up. This day of the tengu event is another **ed up deal. I decided to order the pre-order from ebay wednesday morning, it might not make it in time, then I will have spent 22 bucks (7+15 express shipping) for nothing, a useless pre-order. Seriously, I might get so angry I might go to my school and kill people, and none of that "its just a game" bs, I have spent 100s of hours of my life on this game, am about to spend 100s more, yet I wont get to fully enjoy it, enjoy all of the beautiful skins. I think people should be able to either buy the special stuff, and get it easily, like if people buy the pre-order, they can get the masks easily, but if a person misses it because of events outside their control, they can still EARN it, even if by doing an insanely hard quest or a certain amount of pvp to get it. That means if anyone missed the pumpkin head, santa hat, horns of grenthy, tengu mask, or didnt buy a CE to get the divine aura, they can still get them, it will just cost them time and lots of hardcore playing. And, for naysayers, I bought the CE, and was at both Halloween and Wintersday, and I still dont mind if someone wants to earn what I payed for or spent a few hours to get.